Meaning of "Un cadre"

In the Lesson 5.2 quiz is the question, "Which one doesn't mean "painting/picture"?" The answers to choose from are: - Un tableau - Une table - Un cadre - Une peinture The expected response is, "Une table." I also wonder about "Un cadre." To say it's a painting or picture is a stretch. I looked "cadre" up in more than one dictionary and learned that it has more than one possible translation (including executive manager, and frame of a bike); the closest that could come to a "painting/picture" is the frame around the picture. It doesn't appear that "cadre" is the actual picture. This is an example of an earlier discussion on quiz choices that introduce words that have not yet been in lessons, leading to guessing. Of course, even without guessing, "Un table" is obviously not a painting or picture; that word is already known. A website search finds the word "cadre" introduced in Lesson 17.

Bonjour Diana, You are right to point this out. The quiz would be just as effective using words that have already been covered. Cadre should be replaced by "une chambre" for example. Antidote points out that using cadre as a painting is not something one would do in France, but perhaps in Canada or in Belgium... See the definitions below. Définitions de cadre, nom masculin et féminin Un cadre : bordure entourant un tableau, une photo, un miroir, une fenêtre, etc. Cadre en bois richement travaillé d’une peinture ancienne. BELGIQUE, SUISSE, QUÉBEC, FAMILIER – Tableau, peinture, illustration encadrée. Poser des cadres pour décorer son salon. Assemblage rigide de pièces formant une armature, un châssis. Cadre d’une bicyclette. Décor, environnement, entourage. Château situé dans un cadre enchanteur. Circonstances, contexte d’une action. Roman qui a pour cadre l’Italie de la Renaissance. Ce qui limite, qui circonscrit. Sortir du cadre de ses fonctions, du cadre de la légalité. Dans le cadre de cette thèse. INFORMATIQUE – Subdivision rectangulaire en bordure d’une page HTML qui n’est pas affectée par la modification de celle-ci. Les cadres : ensemble du personnel d’encadrement, de direction d’une entreprise, d’un organisme. Un, une cadre : personne qui participe à la direction d’une entreprise, d’un organisme. Cadre supérieur. Jeune cadre dynamique. A+ -Jason

Bonjour à tous les deux! I can completely understand the confusion. However, despite the fact that it is most commonly used to refer to the surrounding frame of a painting or photo, there are the odd circumstances under which 'cadre' can be taken to mean the painting itself. For example, sometimes 'cadre' can encompass the scene or background of a painting or photo and in this sense it approaches the meaning of painting and photo. I hope this helps somewhat and keep up the good work! - Marie-Claire

Bonjour, I think Diana is right to question this. This would fix it: replace "Un cadre" with "Le dessin" which appears in lesson 2.1. This also: change the question to "Which one means "table"?" haha! Why introduce three! levels of difficulty in such a simple question to help test vocabulary. 1) a negative question (which introduces an unnecessary challenge), 2) written as a contraction* 3) then it uses cadre@, which is really manager and frame and used 5 times in that way. Only one place in lesson 17.2 is it used to mean setting. Un cadre magnifique - A beautiful setting * Note that nobody should write with contractions. They are great for speaking but never in professional writing. @ In France, nobody would use cadre to describe a photo or a painting. The Canadians know this, which is why they have Antidote software to help keep it straight: Un cadre : bordure entourant un tableau, une photo, un miroir, une fenêtre, etc. Cadre en bois richement travaillé d’une peinture ancienne. belgique, suisse, québec, familier – Tableau, peinture, illustration encadrée. Poser des cadres pour décorer son salon. Best Regards, Jason

Bonjour Jason, I have to stand by my comment above that there are indeed a few circumstances under which it can take on the meaning of painting but granted, it is not the most direct translation. I will get onto changing this right away. Keep the comments coming and keep up the good work! - Marie-Claire

Bonjour Marie-Claire, Yes, you are right, I'm sure that in context, I would even understand that usage. It's just that I agree with Diana in the spirit that the lesson can be improved. I see you have taken it like a champion! I really appreciate that. I will enjoy the course more each time I see something getting better with your efforts and the comments and ideas of everybody here. Merci beaucoup!

Bonjour Jason, Mais de rien! Je voulais tout simplement que vous ayez une idée un peu plus complète. Bah écoutez, je suis ravie de reçevoir vos commentaires parce qu'on peut faire toutes les améliorations que l'on veut mais sans votre contribution on ne sait pas vraiment dans quelle direction il faut aller. Donc, dans ce sens là, c'est à nous de VOUS remercier. Courage! - Marie-Claire

At the expense of carrying this one out to extremes, may I make one more comment. Jason, you are right, we wouldn't use contractions in formal English, such as in journals devoted to scientific studies. However, contractions are accetable in many other situations, such as Rocket Languages. The latter presents examples of both of formal and informal language usage; in this way students can learn a wide variety of usages. Besides, Rocket French was designed for students already fluent in English and would, therefore, be comfortable with the word doesn't. I also learned in English classes that contractions lend a feeling of familiarity to the writing; they are less stilted. Personally, I used contractions all the time in my writing, depending on the context. I would, therefore, say that in Lesson 5.2, there's nothing wrong with the word doesn't.

Diana,

Yeah, it's true but I must enjoy: 钻牛角尖

http://www.mdbg.net/chindict/chindict.php?wdrst=0&wdqb=zuanniujiaojian

The My Vocab and Phrase Finder work better when we can avoid the ' character because it is often typed differently. So I try to fight this problem in two ways. First, I ask that Rocket Languages only allow the language editor to type a ' character. Second, I ask that we follow good written language practices.

It's fine if somebody wants to use contractions in the forums and on their personal blogs, but for the formal material, why not dump the contractions? In this case I wanted to just provide another reason to remove the negative question.

(looks like this new forum thing has some bugs. My keyboard is stuck in French and the word wrap is a bit broken... and it put quotes around my web link)

-Jason